TOPIC:

wrote:

Nowhere near 1 million in population in the 1970's , zones that were far far smaller in both size & number and which were representative of each club's lie mostly
And a sport bias that was really big on Aussie Rules & of course Cricket - even Soccer was quite small in popularity 
No mandurah crap and country towns had their supported club for many decades prior

The big difference between the socio-economic mix from past era's lets say up the the end of the 70's is immigration. I don't think family wealth made such a big difference back in the 60's/70's. Didn't matter if your old man was a carpenter or a doctor, one might argue the son of a carpenter might be a bit harder at the contest. The common thing was all 8 WAFL clubs zones were full of Aussies and the Italians and Yugoslav's seemed to adapt to our game better than the African/Indian/Middle East/Asian immigrants of today.

South Fremantle and West a Perth are testament to that. I know for a fact that suburbs like Kewdale, Rivervale, Belmont, Bentley, Cannington, Queens Park today are heavily populated with these immigrants. We know the African kids are adapting to AFL footy although the game is foreign to them when they arrive here, more so their parents but we might see the sons of the sons and daughters who are born here take the game up from a young age.

What percentage of the modern day immigrants take up residency in the rich western suburbs, or Fremantle and either side of Canning Hwy, or the northern coastal corridor? Not until you get east of Wanneroo Rd, then all of a sudden you feel like a minority if you are a born and bred Aussie in Nollamara, Balga, Mirrabooka, Girrawheen etc... Same if you are a born and bred Aussie living in Kewdale where Kewdale High School is now a Muslim school. A white Aussie living in Cannington? You'd look out of place.

I look at Claremont yesterday and I don't see a hint of anything but white Australian kids who's parents are brought up on Aussie rules football and they have very few imports outside their zone.

People had to assimilate in the past, an expectation, which, is largely non-existent today.

Interesting social changes there but that still doesn't explain why Perth zoned kids aren't as successful. They are equal in number to other clubs. Is the standard of junior footy just not as good? 

Jl: It is not about the standard of the football, rather, it is if one can afford the boots.

wrote:

wrote:

Nowhere near 1 million in population in the 1970's , zones that were far far smaller in both size & number and which were representative of each club's lie mostly
And a sport bias that was really big on Aussie Rules & of course Cricket - even Soccer was quite small in popularity 
No mandurah crap and country towns had their supported club for many decades prior

The big difference between the socio-economic mix from past era's lets say up the the end of the 70's is immigration. I don't think family wealth made such a big difference back in the 60's/70's. Didn't matter if your old man was a carpenter or a doctor, one might argue the son of a carpenter might be a bit harder at the contest. The common thing was all 8 WAFL clubs zones were full of Aussies and the Italians and Yugoslav's seemed to adapt to our game better than the African/Indian/Middle East/Asian immigrants of today.

South Fremantle and West a Perth are testament to that. I know for a fact that suburbs like Kewdale, Rivervale, Belmont, Bentley, Cannington, Queens Park today are heavily populated with these immigrants. We know the African kids are adapting to AFL footy although the game is foreign to them when they arrive here, more so their parents but we might see the sons of the sons and daughters who are born here take the game up from a young age.

What percentage of the modern day immigrants take up residency in the rich western suburbs, or Fremantle and either side of Canning Hwy, or the northern coastal corridor? Not until you get east of Wanneroo Rd, then all of a sudden you feel like a minority if you are a born and bred Aussie in Nollamara, Balga, Mirrabooka, Girrawheen etc... Same if you are a born and bred Aussie living in Kewdale where Kewdale High School is now a Muslim school. A white Aussie living in Cannington? You'd look out of place.

I look at Claremont yesterday and I don't see a hint of anything but white Australian kids who's parents are brought up on Aussie rules football and they have very few imports outside their zone.

We have seen the explosion in popularity in the other sports along with the immigration boom - soccer , basketball probably the biggest
Schools now have certain sports that are heavier in focus or orientation and there are non-contact sport emphasises in areas that contain certain cultures
A big factor in question is the skewed zone areas since 1997 - it's just a mess now and we see these effects sharply now , it's taken one 20 year generation almost to the day 
That's a lot of talent in other words

wrote:

Yes, interesting Southerner.

But what happened to Perth? Did anything happen to their zone in comparison to the other clubs? Were there better jobs in the Carlisle area then? Has Perth become more uneven? What is the difference in house prices now between Carlisle and Claremont and what was it then?

The Perth zone has equal junior players but they apparently aren't as good as the other kids jn Perth and haven't been for 40 years. Why? 

Or is TT correct and the above paragraph false?

not sure about the 40 years and there have been far longer droughts in footy of course , but I will say the real decline could be traced back to 1997 (which co-incidentally until 2020  was the last season Perth had made the finals)
There was some quizzical decisions made by Dorrington & co when they invented Mandurah and an eventual alignment had to be made because it hasn't worked at all

Hey STT.,.....Just had a look at the Wafl metropolitan zones.Perths zone looks smaller than the other clubs.When you look on the map next to the listed suburbs and local governments..
The country zone looks quiet big.Nothing to far outside the metropolitan area.All less than 100 KMs from Perth Metro..Old farming towns.Not sure of the participation of players in those country leagues..
Page 112 Wafl rules+ regulations 2021..You do have quiet a large coastline in your country zone.

STT your most western part of your Metro zone.Just south of Perth City on the Swan River.Is a long way from a suburban beach area.

wrote:

I look at Claremont yesterday and I don't see a hint of anything but white Australian kids who's parents are brought up on Aussie rules football and they have very few imports outside their zone.

So Claremont had no indigenous players running around yesterday? Decisions on WAFL zone boundaries aren't made on how many Australian looking white people are walking around the local shopping centre. 

The 2009 WAFC Zone review, which looked at participation rates of Boys aged 5-18 years old, demonstrated that:

• Subiaco and East Fremantle had the lowest population and participation rates across their metro and regional zones
• Swan Districts had the highest population and participation across metro and regional zones. South Fremantle the highest participation in the metro zones.
• Clubs ranked in order of metro participants (% players v population males 5-18yrs)
  • South Freo - 5400 (24%)
  • West Perth - 5100 (24%)
  • Swan Districts - 5000 (24%)
  • Perth - 4800 (25%)
  • Peel - 4700 (26%)
  • Claremont  - 4200 (34%)
  • East Fremantle - 4100 (29%)
  • East Perth - 3600 (20%)
  • Subiaco - 3400 (29%)
• Interesting to note:
  • Perth has the third highest number of participants when their metro and country zone numbers were added together. 
  • Despite being ranked 5th - 8th on % of participation SF, WP, SD and P are ranked 1st - 4th for actual metro participants

This 2009 data is extremely relevant as:

• the 5 year olds would now be playing Futures or Colts - AFL draft hopefuls this year.
• the 8 year olds would now be entering senior football
• the 18 years olds would now be early 30s and likely at the end of their senior career

Whilst I understand the argument about the influence of non-football playing immigrants on participation in zones the data from 2009 shows that this is false in all cases except possibly East Perth. 

In regards to the impact of socioeconomic status on participation this again seems to be overstated as 6 of the WAFL club zones show participation levels of 24-29% of boys aged 5-18 years. Perth is ranked 5th at 25%. 4 of these 6 clubs have coastal metro zones. 

So since 2009 what have the zones produced? Is it fair to assume that for every AFL player that a WAFL zone produces that they will produce a higher number WAFL quality players?
AFL Draftees since 2009

• Claremont  - 44
• East Fremantle - 35
• South Freo - 31
• Swan Districts - 27
• Perth - 22
• Peel - 19
• Subiaco - 16
• West Perth - 15
• East Perth - 12

So why is Perth's zone considered so bad given that it has:

• 4th highest number of metro male participants and 3rd overall when metro and country are combined
• 5th highest participation % of population of 5 -18 year old boys
• produced the 5th highest number of AFL draftees since 2009 

The zone is no worse than most clubs from whatever angle you look at it. Whilst 6 of the 9 WAFL clubs have won League premierships since 2009, Perth have hardly played finals in the last 40 years

Is that a lack of available talent in the Perth district? The numbers say its not...

if anything this thread should be retitled to Fix the East Perth Zone

You need do do some stats on how many kids from all the zones are still playing footy at 16-18, that is the key.
And unfortunate as it is the number of kids in each zone completing year 12 would be the highest in the richer areas and that is a big challenge for clubs in low socio economic areas as kids are disengaged, youth crime is higher and less money to go around for families.