TOPIC:

Unholytugboat wrote:

oh yeah, forcing mortal enemies to equally negotiate is a great idea Swan....

Probably why they put the onus on the bad guys to step forward, negotiate, and prove they were willing to be civil in exchange for US pull out.

Yeah , sitting down with a bunch of terrorist who you have been trying to and failing to destroy for the last 20 years and giving them ligitmacy is a really great idea. then agreeing to the following.

1. If you leave and give us what we want we wont hurt you until you leave, but you must leave when we say you have to. 

Trump was even going to invite the Taliban to Camp David until they blew up some US forces , he cancelled that then continued with his surrender pull out deal on the quiet. 

Pompeo and Trump Clown show,
 

BC wrote:

I'm enjoying this thread as it's interesting to see the different take on things. What's not good to see is that the Trump legacy lives on. I can't believe with all the loonies living in the US that someone hasn't "neutralised" the Donald by now.

His two election lawyers just got recommended for disbarrment for fraud and misleading conduct, and the Capitol commission inquiry is in now seeking communications for his mobster family on the day, you know the ones hiding in the tent watching the riot and having champers.

Unholytugboat wrote:

Thats the problem BC, different takes, there is only one set of facts, clearly the agreement puts the onus on the Taliban to broker peace with the Afghans and negotiate a permanent ceasefire. In return for this the Americans and its allies will withdraw troops from Afghanistan and vacate if they can hold up to the agreement.

It is really simple.

Problem was, change of presidency, just like China & Russia did the Taliban started to push boundaries because Biden is seen as weak. 

Trump is such an abhorrent lunatic I do not think anyone could predict what he would have done in early 2021 if he was in charge, no doubt it would have involved bombs & drones.

But for people to say this is Trumps fault is complete lunacy, even CNN have turned on Biden, but then again does anyone honestly believe a president who is not allowed to hold his own press conferences is really in charge?


 

Garbage. Saying these events exist in a vacum with nothing to do with the prior administration is deluded and ignorant.

The agreement prevented the US attacking Taliban forces unless the Taliban attacked the US, that never happened, The Taliban was free to attack and kill Afghan forces at will, which is what they did and Trump and the US did nothing to stop them the troop draw down gathered pace. 

tell me how good was Trump at looking after the Kurds - great US allies in Syria.

I'll tell you,  he got fooled ( not Hard with Trump ) by Erdogan from Turkey into pulling out, who then went on to wipe out 130,000 US allies, and then let his side kick Putin move into the US bases, - how many Kurds did Trump help evacuate out of there - ZERO , one of the most disgraceful episodes of his 4 years.

That was pretty much the template for Afghanistan, pack up leave and screw them.

America First,

Bazza it is just mind numbing that anyone could think that Trump would have been able to evacuate thousands without incident.  

As for the deluded Trump acolytes who think that he won in the 2020, they have moved to an alternate universe.

Biden has completely botched this, history will not be kind to him

Unholytugboat wrote:

Biden has completely botched this, history will not be kind to him

Hey just wondering what part the 5000 Taliban fighters Trump agreed to release prior to leaving as part of his brilliant withdrawl plan played any part in the Taliban take over, given half of them were regarded as their best fighters, and it was done with no consent with the Afghan Gov?

Asking for a friend?
 

swan42 wrote:

Bazza it is just mind numbing that anyone could think that Trump would have been able to evacuate thousands without incident.  

As for the deluded Trump acolytes who think that he won in the 2020, they have moved to an alternate universe.

Swan. there would of been no evacuations, Trump was cutting and running 31 May, gone, one should ask how many he got out in the 11 months he had after the deal was done - the answer is - none. Once they left the Taliban would of walked back and stranded the lot, no doubt this is what Trump would of wanted rather than 80,000 muslims landing in the US. Plenty of confected outrage about stranded Afghans by the MAGA mob, give me a break.

Biden made the mistake to taking the Pentagon and CIAs word that the Afghan Army would last at least 12 months, clearly that was a huge error. 

In a catastrophic and sudden collapse, just bear this in mind,  Biden has been able to elevate the small force left behind from 2500 to 6000 in 9 days, has organised a airlift that to date has evacuated over 80,000 in a matter of couple of weeks, its by far the greatest human airlift in US history, in very difficult and dangerous conditions, full credit to all involved.

Btw Pathetic effort from us closed our emabssy months ago and have already pulled the ADF out and ended evacuations, the US and UK are boxing on right to the 31st. 

Bazza wrote:

swan42 wrote:

Bazza it is just mind numbing that anyone could think that Trump would have been able to evacuate thousands without incident.  

As for the deluded Trump acolytes who think that he won in the 2020, they have moved to an alternate universe.

Swan. there would of been no evacuations, Trump was cutting and running 31 May, gone, one should ask how many he got out in the 11 months he had after the deal was done - the answer is - none. Once they left the Taliban would of walked back and stranded the lot, no doubt this is what Trump would of wanted rather than 80,000 muslims landing in the US. Plenty of confected outrage about stranded Afghans by the MAGA mob, give me a break.

Biden made the mistake to taking the Pentagon and CIAs word that the Afghan Army would last at least 12 months, clearly that was a huge error. 

In a catastrophic and sudden collapse, just bear this in mind,  Biden has been able to elevate the small force left behind from 2500 to 6000 in 9 days, has organised a airlift that to date has evacuated over 80,000 in a matter of couple of weeks, its by far the greatest human airlift in US history, in very difficult and dangerous conditions, full credit to all involved.

Btw Pathetic effort from us closed our emabssy months ago and have already pulled the ADF out and ended evacuations, the US and UK are boxing on right to the 31st. 

I think you have summarised Trump's psyche very accurately.

With respect to Australia's response one wonders why we pulled out our diplomatic staff months ago and it would seem do nothing from that time until the 11th hour before we attempted to get the Afghanis who worked with us out of the country.

I think the reason why we have pulled the ADF out already is obvious.

Very poor decision to close the embassy so early.

For mine if the US and UK and others are there to the end so we should be.

Which idiot went there in the first place, bush?