TOPIC:

Grump wrote:

Bazza and others do you think the fundamental difference in this whole crapfest is that the US and it allies where fighting on political grounds whereas the Taliban were fighting on a religious level, to my mind religion will oft win out in this sort of conflict.

The politics of Trump and Biden is an example , to me, of just how stupid the US is, one sets it up for failure and the is to dumb and old to see he is riding towards  a deep chasm. It does give the the don ammunition to counter or weigh against Old joes ammunition abt the vaccines.

Just more stupidity in and from the US!

As the Taliban, supposedly say, the US have watches we have time. No the Taliban are political they just use religion as a means to an end.

wrote:

It would be interesting to hear some theories about what could have been done under a Trump administration's withdrawal that would have materially changed in Afghanistan after the withdrawal of the USA defence forces.

It would of been worse and more chaotic.

Lets not forget these facts.

Trumps agreed WITH the Taliban to pull out all forces by May - with some weak conditions he clearly had no interest in enforceing, 

He then set about undermining any hope the US had of controlling the pull out be reducing forces early, remember Esper said the minimum must be 4500, What does Trump do..fires Esper and cuts them to 2500 right on the verge of leaving, how low can you go?

It would of been like this but in May and probably uglier and more rushed.

I see even John Howard has come out today and blamed Trumps crap deal.



 

Ti Em wrote:

Grump wrote:

Bazza and others do you think the fundamental difference in this whole crapfest is that the US and it allies where fighting on political grounds whereas the Taliban were fighting on a religious level, to my mind religion will oft win out in this sort of conflict.

The politics of Trump and Biden is an example , to me, of just how stupid the US is, one sets it up for failure and the is to dumb and old to see he is riding towards  a deep chasm. It does give the the don ammunition to counter or weigh against Old joes ammunition abt the vaccines.

Just more stupidity in and from the US!

As the Taliban, supposedly say, the US have watches we have time. No the Taliban are political they just use religion as a means to an end.

Yep - Remember Nixons peace with honor pledge, while he was sabotaging the peace talks before the election 

Any women and children coming in with this lot?? All I have seen is pics of young fighting age men

DG wrote:

Any women and children coming in with this lot?? All I have seen is pics of young fighting age men

I haven't seen the pictures but I think the explanation may  be that they are the ones who acted as interpreters/guides with our defence personnel and would have been mainly men.

No the pictures of hundreds of young fit men chasing the big US cargo plains down the strip indicates who they believe should be saved, ie every MAN for himself. Just another example of their ingrained disrespect for women let along the children.

The media keep pointing the finger at the US and their coalition partners including us, 20 years of fighting these religious fanatics, pushing them back into their stone age mountain caves was stage 1, stage 2 was to maintain some control and stability while we trained their own army and armed them to the teeth at the coalitions expense. Stage 3 was to gradually pull the coalition troops out and let their own armed forces take responsibility for their security. Sensible plan but it all goes to shit when one aspect, the Afghan armed forces, failed to do their duty and bent over and took it up the clacker from the Taliban, almost without firing a shot. There was a real expectation that their army would show some backbone and that didn't happen so it all fell apart like a stack of cards in a matter of days. Biden was spot on when he said something along the lines of  "if they wont defend themselves then why should others continue to put themselves in harms way to defend them". It's a sad tragic situation but time to get as many out as possible and level them to their own devices

Reports coming out of Afghanistan in recent days.Have talked about the reformation of the Mujahideen.It appears not all ran from the Taliban. 
During the civil war between Democatic Republic of Afghanistan.Allied to the Visiting Soviet Union troops.In conflict with the Mujahideen backed by the CIA.The Panjshir Valley was not conquered by the Soviets.In the 1990's the Taliban encircled the region for over 5 years.But where not successful. 
Ahmed Masood son of Famous Mujahideen and Northern Alliance leader Ahmed Shah Masood.Has had a massive influx of retreating government forces.Special forces trained by British and Australian SAS soldiers.And tribesmen from all over Afghanistan in all age demographics. 
The Panjshir valley is about 200 kms north west of Kabul. Its a high elevation mountainous area.From that location Ahmed Masood said that the Taliban has so far avoided this region.Its the only area not occupied by the Taliban.
Mr Masood would like  negotiations with the Taliban.As he told a German newspaper.And has opened dialogue with the Taliban.Not sure if the Taliban are in the peace making mood atm.

I must be naive. Why wouldn't the coalition of forces have evacuated Afgani's at risk and issued visa's for any fearing reprisals from the Taliban while they had control of Kabul and other provinces before they pulled out?

Surely they aren't that dumb not to realise as soon as they withdraw the Taliban will take over? The whole thing is a monumental failure.

gtrxuone wrote:

Reports coming out of Afghanistan in recent days.Have talked about the reformation of the Mujahideen.It appears not all ran from the Taliban. 
During the civil war between Democatic Republic of Afghanistan.Allied to the Visiting Soviet Union troops.In conflict with the Mujahideen backed by the CIA.The Panjshir Valley was not conquered by the Soviets.In the 1990's the Taliban encircled the region for over 5 years.But where not successful. 
Ahmed Masood son of Famous Mujahideen and Northern Alliance leader Ahmed Shah Masood.Has had a massive influx of retreating government forces.Special forces trained by British and Australian SAS soldiers.And tribesmen from all over Afghanistan in all age demographics. 
The Panjshir valley is about 200 kms north west of Kabul. Its a high elevation mountainous area.From that location Ahmed Masood said that the Taliban has so far avoided this region.Its the only area not occupied by the Taliban.
Mr Masood would like  negotiations with the Taliban.As he told a German newspaper.And has opened dialogue with the Taliban.Not sure if the Taliban are in the peace making mood atm.

More than 1 in 3 of your posts get a thank you gtrxuone. Wow. I will keep a closer look out but your above post looks like a cut and past. Very difficult to read. No spacing or any grammar at all. I will look with interest on how you have managed such rave reviews in the past

The yanks have managed to get 70,700 out already, shaping up to be one of the biggest air lifts in history, pretty obvious the vast majority are now Afghan "Asylum" seekers rather than foreign nationals.