TOPIC:

Once again, sleepy Joe nods off while at the wheel.

BC wrote:

After the Russians were defeated, with no overarching government, warlords took over Afghanistan until the Taliban was formed almost by chance which brought a certain amount of certainty to the regions even if it was by force. Until then, anyone moving between provinces had to pay the warlord of that region and then again to the next and so on. Certainly in southern Afghanistan the Taliban will be welcomed to some extent but in saying that, I wouldn't want to be one of the ethnic minorities, females or anyone who helped the allies. They are a brutal regime and think we'll see large amounts of refugees trying to escape through Iran, then Turkey and onto Europe.

The Yanks, spent years helping the Mujaheeden defeat the USSR armed them up to the teeth, blow pipe missles the works, The USSR while a huge military were having all sorts of economic problems most of their gear was pretty antiquated and the wheels feel off the invasion, the CIA created a power vacum and the Mujas morphed into the Taliban and Al Queda, the war lords ran the show and the place has been a basket case ever since.

In the main the locals don't seem to fussed about the fall of the US Supported President and his corrupt chronies, the entire place has been run on bribes and pay offs, the US have spent Billions on paying off Tribes and Pollies to keep some semblance of order, they raked the quids in built plenty of mansions along the way.  

Most of the money Canberra was sending over for "training" of local armies was quickly taken and stashed away by corrupt "generals"  who had no loyalty to the project at all.

Then Trump and clownarse Pompeo does a deal with the Taliban last February to pull out in May, ( totally excluding the local goverment)  but he tweeted that he wanted them out by last Christmas, along the way the deal allowed for 5000 Taliban fighters to be freed, who went straight out and re armed. 

No wonder Mattis their best General said the guy wasnt fit to lead.

It's pretty obvious the local "army" had already done a deal to let the Taliban take over without a shot fired. 

Southerner wrote:

it's desert version of Vietnam - and the locals know it like the backs of their hands and easily cope with it , we provided some respite from outright war for a time 
war means loss of life and that's the terrible part when there's no resolution

Theres a resolution alright, after 20 years the Taliban won.

Ti Em wrote:

Bazza wrote:

What a waste of time, money and lives that was.

The Orange Man signed a deal with the Taliban to pull out by May, the rest is now history. 

The bottom line was if the locals can't be stuffed fighting for their own country then after 20 years another year or 5 would not of made much difference.

What happened to all the great expensive training the ADF was providing to the local army?

 

The Guardian's diplomatic editor Patrick Wintour was quite critical of president Biden yesterday putting 29 February as the date of the US-Taliban agreement and also highlighting that as recently as 8 July the US president had said that there was no likelihood of Afghanistan being overrun.

The deal was signed in February 2020, by Trump,  

Yes the Pentagon advice was that at worst it would take 6 Months for the Taliban to take over, guess it shows just how out of touch the yanks were, mind you Trump spent 4 years undermining the entire thing saying all he wanted to do was get out and the sooner the better.

Biden was on the money when he said we cant help those who aren't prepared to help themselves. The local so called military were never interested in fighting the Taliban, more likely welcoming them into power.

I feel for the women of Afghanistan as the Taliban will certainly lead the country back into the stone age, no education, no rights, no jobs etc.

l once said to 'gtr' on here that I would never vote for Biden under any circumstances, an utterence, which,on this occasion, has survived well. Forces should have been maintained to hold the cities and counter terrorism operations. The terrorists and commies always fight to win cities, not the country side; the Americans never lost the cities in either Afghanistan or Vietnam; apparently there has been no battle losses for a year. Interestingly, during the election nethier Trump or Biden promised to leave.

ArkRoyal wrote:

l once said to 'gtr' on here that I would never vote for Biden under any circumstances, an utterence, which,on this occasion, has survived well. Forces should have been maintained to hold the cities and counter terrorism operations. The terrorists and commies always fight to win cities, not the country side; the Americans never lost the cities in either Afghanistan or Vietnam; apparently there has been no battle losses for a year. Interestingly, during the election nethier Trump or Biden promised to leave.

Do you mean hypothetically or do you on occasions vote in US elections Ark?

ArkRoyal wrote:

l once said to 'gtr' on here that I would never vote for Biden under any circumstances, an utterence, which,on this occasion, has survived well. Forces should have been maintained to hold the cities and counter terrorism operations. The terrorists and commies always fight to win cities, not the country side; the Americans never lost the cities in either Afghanistan or Vietnam; apparently there has been no battle losses for a year. Interestingly, during the election nethier Trump or Biden promised to leave.

Trump was too busy telling new lies - the promise of pulling out of Afghanistan had by then become just a lie from the previous election.

ArkRoyal wrote:

l once said to 'gtr' on here that I would never vote for Biden under any circumstances, an utterence, which,on this occasion, has survived well. Forces should have been maintained to hold the cities and counter terrorism operations. The terrorists and commies always fight to win cities, not the country side; the Americans never lost the cities in either Afghanistan or Vietnam; apparently there has been no battle losses for a year. Interestingly, during the election nethier Trump or Biden promised to leave.

I dont know where you have been Ark , but honestly that is the biggest pile of tripe out, Trump signed the deal in February 2020 with the Taliban to leave by May 2021, his entire 4 years was about ending all wars bringing troops home and getting the hell out of Afgahnstan, he was saying it opening through the entire campaign, we are ending the endless war, no surprise given he had basically signed a surreder with the Taliban in Feb 2020, which by the way the local goverment were totaly excluded from.

Mattis resigned as a result,

Then the troop pull outs started immedialy , and surprise surprise just on the eve of leaving office Trumps new Defence secretary ( what was that no. 5?) Miller annouces a total withdrawal down to 2500 ( from 13,000 when Trump signed his crap deal) , and all gone by May 2021 as per the deal. Against advice of Joint Chiefs,

You might also have conveinetly have forgotten that Trump tweeted I want all the troops out by Xmas 2020, that was a bit of the shock to the pentagon.

Biden managed to extend the withdrawal out from May to August, But they had to get out eventually - that was about the best he could do. A force of 2500 isnt viable in the event of a full scale local civil war. 

By the way he authorised air strikes as late as July this year to try and help the local "army".

And Biden through out the campaign made no secret of the fact that he would not be handing Afganistan over to another president.  The US was leaving and that was it.

After 20 years and 1 trillion bucks and thousands of lives and you think suddenly they were goner save the day and win somehow? in that last minute?

Malarkey.

Its over they and us lost just like Vietnam.






 

did you support him--nobody on here supported his arguments, espescially you. Trump would have pulled out of Korea if he could. This will leave a power vacuum which will aid our enemies. Now, if you were to instead, to say,' it is no the end of the world 'I would agree . Don't confuse the politics and the military, there is relationship, but they are not them  osame. If the Taliban had had the capacities you claim it would have defeated the original US invasion