TOPIC:

Freezin wrote: Ooooolll don't forget George is on a fair bit too.....needs to be....to pay his entourage......wish one could tell who is telling porkies and who isn't......

No Porkies here, just substantiated facts.

therealswansman wrote:

gtrxuone wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

gtrxuone wrote: The realswansman..How did SD allmost lose 1 million between 2011-12..Was that caused by Alignment MK2.When Wafl crowds dropped off 20%.

The simple answer is they spent more than they earned.
They paid today's bills with tomorrows money
They accrued the income but not the expenses.
The whole concept of proper accounting is that you draw a line in the sand and bring to account what is owed and what is owing at a particular date, Then you know where you stand. Every business should do it monthly.
Swans failed to do this and when the new treasurer was appointed at the 2012 AGM he set about doing this and redid the 2011 accounts to take into account monies used for the construction of two houses, a grant that had to be repaid because of non compliance and other grant monies that were taken in as income but actually were funds in advance for the following year and a miriad of other operational expenses paid in 2012 that were actually 2011 so then backdated.
When all accounted for, loss of $911k.
Any other questions.

Yes please 2 more question.
Under the Swans current business model + adding clubs like WP.Will there be a Wafl competition in a decades time .Does the Wafc still audit the clubs books.

1. if there is a AFL reserves comp, then Eagles and Freo won't have to pay a levy for their teams to be in the WAFL hence less money to the other WAFL clubs. and they could sink.
The WAFC started dismantling the WAFL when it set up separate junior Districts that the WAFL clubs had no control over and now the colts sides are a product of those comps.
The Pathway will hence be juniors to colts to AFL reserves with the WAFL clubs fending for themselves, some will die.
2. The WAFC has never audited the WAFL club books. Annually the WAFL clubs, usually CEO and Finance Director , front the finance committee of the WAFC and discuss their clubs position.

Considering all the talk about a certain club continually paying well above the salary cap I found that amazing TRSM....although hardly surprising!

Beasley Hutton wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

gtrxuone wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

gtrxuone wrote: The realswansman..How did SD allmost lose 1 million between 2011-12..Was that caused by Alignment MK2.When Wafl crowds dropped off 20%.

The simple answer is they spent more than they earned.
They paid today's bills with tomorrows money
They accrued the income but not the expenses.
The whole concept of proper accounting is that you draw a line in the sand and bring to account what is owed and what is owing at a particular date, Then you know where you stand. Every business should do it monthly.
Swans failed to do this and when the new treasurer was appointed at the 2012 AGM he set about doing this and redid the 2011 accounts to take into account monies used for the construction of two houses, a grant that had to be repaid because of non compliance and other grant monies that were taken in as income but actually were funds in advance for the following year and a miriad of other operational expenses paid in 2012 that were actually 2011 so then backdated.
When all accounted for, loss of $911k.
Any other questions.

Yes please 2 more question.
Under the Swans current business model + adding clubs like WP.Will there be a Wafl competition in a decades time .Does the Wafc still audit the clubs books.

1. if there is a AFL reserves comp, then Eagles and Freo won't have to pay a levy for their teams to be in the WAFL hence less money to the other WAFL clubs. and they could sink.
The WAFC started dismantling the WAFL when it set up separate junior Districts that the WAFL clubs had no control over and now the colts sides are a product of those comps.
The Pathway will hence be juniors to colts to AFL reserves with the WAFL clubs fending for themselves, some will die.
2. The WAFC has never audited the WAFL club books. Annually the WAFL clubs, usually CEO and Finance Director , front the finance committee of the WAFC and discuss their clubs position.

Considering all the talk about a certain club continually paying well above the salary cap I found that amazing TRSM....although hardly surprising!

I was referring to a financial Audit.
Yes the WAFC check player payments against the contracts list sent to them.
Unless a club was stupid enough to have available for viewing 2 sets of accounts, deliberate rorting of the salary cap would never be picked up in a normal audit.
The method used by some clubs is to have sponsors / supporters purchase a VISA debit card (purchase at Post office) and load $$ on to it and have the club give it to a player, Untraceable purchases are then made by the player.
Payments considered by clubs to be outside of normal player payments, like Swans paying for Gaepans parents to come over and watch a milestone game are picked up by the WAFC inspection were considered as player payments undeclared but even when included Swans were still under the cap, although they were fined for sloppy paperwork

therealswansman wrote:

Freezin wrote: Ooooolll don't forget George is on a fair bit too.....needs to be....to pay his entourage......wish one could tell who is telling porkies and who isn't......

No Porkies here, just substantiated facts.

Well the challenge has been laid down, interesting to see if old mate and his mate take it up.

As for George, well he well and truly deserves every $ he is on, bet he won't be getting the West Perth 4 cents in every $ up at Basso.

Pretty good up their at Joondalup, pay all their players 100 cents in the $, just not their bills and creditors.

And then for good humour the WP boys have FF at work on the EF site, but seriously if he is getting more than 4 cents in every $ for his contributions then its over the mark. Unless of course his pocket money is 10 bucks a week.

Anyhow, pretty impressed with the explanation from therealswansman. Seemed factual, considered and (importantly) happy to stump up if proved wrong.

therealswansman wrote:

Leedy wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

Leedy wrote:

Leedy wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

DD wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

Leedy wrote:

Beasley Hutton wrote:

Leedy wrote:

Swandog wrote: Seems a few people on here with axes to grind, take your negative crap to another club then if you don't like it, at least we are getting ourselves out of a financial hole all by ourselves unlike other clubs as was highlighted to me on Sat. Cant please everybody and mistakes are made, a football club is no different. Cant wait for round one! Get behind the club!

Laughable mate, I know the fella personally and he 100% did not receive his match payments for that particular year so you are ill informed, he wouldn't make this shit up, no rhyme or reason too.


Calm down Swandog, clearly a dig at WP above. As I have mentioned on many occasions I don't give a shit how we survive, as long as we survive. Swans are no orphans mate because "Not paying a number of players their match payments" would have left you in a similar situation to us, at least we paid 4c in the dollar

I am not sure I understand what you are trying to state here Leedy...you are comparing apples with oranges mate?
It was reported last year the WAFC paid the WP players, coaches and staff last year and then you virtually walked away from paying your creditors including the ATO & State Government department VenuesWest with a paltry 4c in the dollar offer.
This was also reported to be a loan from the WAFC so we can and will expect that will be paid back in full by the WPFC...I am sure there will be many other WAFL club boards watching with interest to make sure they are held to account in this regard!
As far as I am aware the SDFC have never had the WAFC pay our players, coaches and staff ever and I believe we have or are continuing to pay our creditors in full, the ATO was paid back with interest!

BH,

We are all fully versed on what happened to WP, I don't know where in my response earlier that I denied any of it, in fact I said " I couldn't give a shit where the money comes from, as long as we survive". Im just stating that if Swans had actually paid their players one particular year then who knows what would have happened or where they would have ended up ??? Swans simply walked away from paying those players, FACT !!!

Leedy, your comments are not fact.
I can say without any fear of contradiction and will sign for you a statutory declaration to that extent that there was no player who did not receive their match payments.
So check with whoever is feeding you rubbish and come back to me.
Find one person who wasn't paid and not only will I pay them I will pay you double the amount.

Mate what do you do for a crust? You must be on more coin than Phil Smart. Lol

Oh I have plenty of $$ but wion't have to part with any of in this instance because as stated, some trolls from other clubs think they know it all, however in this instance they are way of the mark..

Laughable mate, I know the fella personally and he 100% did not receive his match payments for that particular year so you are ill informed, he wouldn't make this shit up, no rhyme or reason too.

So you have gone from saying that if we had made match payments we would be in the same boat as WP, using that analogy we would owe your friend in excess of $300,000.
Tell him to contact me, I have a complete list of all match payments owed and paid from 2009 - 2016 , the same list that the ATO and WAFC have.
I will check it and reimburse him in full.

, your a muppet, geez some times I reckon Freeze may be right that all you Swannies people are a tad precious, masters of making mountains out of mole hills. To put an end to this, all I am saying is that if Swans had payed their players they may have been in a tad more trouble. Im not saying more or less than WP, my mate didn't receive his match payments, full stop !!!

Leedy, you don't get out of it that easy.
I don't revert to name calling , I deal in substantiated truth.
What you are insinuating is that Swans didn't pay match payments based on your friends say so that he believes he is owed money.
So how much in $$ of match payments is there that you are saying that we missed . Put a figure on it and then ask how would that have placed us anywhere near the WP scenario. .
It is a matter of record that Swans lost over $900k in the 2011/12 period, they were cash strapped, didn't hold up the white flag and paid all their creditors.
It is not about being precious, it is about quashing some of the bull that surrounds Swans past and present situation.
I have documented proof, what you have is innuendo and rumor.
I reiterate, if your friend or any other person can come forward and substantiate that they were not paid, I will reimburse them and give you double.
So either put up or shut up.

You sound articulate in patches Swansmen. Once again, I clearly stated that I am not phased, sure on the actual number of players or even give a shit as to what position Swans would have been in. I am stating that I know for certain 1 x player didn't receive his payments and he said others didn't either (the latter I can agree is unsubstantiated). I don't and won't reveal my source, Swandog and BH know who Im talking about and if they want reveal it, go for gold, for mine, it is irrelevant now, I only mentioned it because it shits me to tears when the likes of yourself, BH and Co go WP bashing, it is what it is, let it go.

To finalise and reiterate, at the initial meeting last year us Members were told we had go down the path we did or fold, there was categorically no other option, Im not a man of numbers so I and all other Members had to back the people in charge and let it pan out.

Leedy wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

Leedy wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

Leedy wrote:

Leedy wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

DD wrote:

therealswansman wrote:

Leedy wrote:

Beasley Hutton wrote:

Leedy wrote:

Swandog wrote: Seems a few people on here with axes to grind, take your negative crap to another club then if you don't like it, at least we are getting ourselves out of a financial hole all by ourselves unlike other clubs as was highlighted to me on Sat. Cant please everybody and mistakes are made, a football club is no different. Cant wait for round one! Get behind the club!

Laughable mate, I know the fella personally and he 100% did not receive his match payments for that particular year so you are ill informed, he wouldn't make this shit up, no rhyme or reason too.


Calm down Swandog, clearly a dig at WP above. As I have mentioned on many occasions I don't give a shit how we survive, as long as we survive. Swans are no orphans mate because "Not paying a number of players their match payments" would have left you in a similar situation to us, at least we paid 4c in the dollar

I am not sure I understand what you are trying to state here Leedy...you are comparing apples with oranges mate?
It was reported last year the WAFC paid the WP players, coaches and staff last year and then you virtually walked away from paying your creditors including the ATO & State Government department VenuesWest with a paltry 4c in the dollar offer.
This was also reported to be a loan from the WAFC so we can and will expect that will be paid back in full by the WPFC...I am sure there will be many other WAFL club boards watching with interest to make sure they are held to account in this regard!
As far as I am aware the SDFC have never had the WAFC pay our players, coaches and staff ever and I believe we have or are continuing to pay our creditors in full, the ATO was paid back with interest!

BH,

We are all fully versed on what happened to WP, I don't know where in my response earlier that I denied any of it, in fact I said " I couldn't give a shit where the money comes from, as long as we survive". Im just stating that if Swans had actually paid their players one particular year then who knows what would have happened or where they would have ended up ??? Swans simply walked away from paying those players, FACT !!!

Leedy, your comments are not fact.
I can say without any fear of contradiction and will sign for you a statutory declaration to that extent that there was no player who did not receive their match payments.
So check with whoever is feeding you rubbish and come back to me.
Find one person who wasn't paid and not only will I pay them I will pay you double the amount.

Mate what do you do for a crust? You must be on more coin than Phil Smart. Lol

Oh I have plenty of $$ but wion't have to part with any of in this instance because as stated, some trolls from other clubs think they know it all, however in this instance they are way of the mark..

Laughable mate, I know the fella personally and he 100% did not receive his match payments for that particular year so you are ill informed, he wouldn't make this shit up, no rhyme or reason too.

So you have gone from saying that if we had made match payments we would be in the same boat as WP, using that analogy we would owe your friend in excess of $300,000.
Tell him to contact me, I have a complete list of all match payments owed and paid from 2009 - 2016 , the same list that the ATO and WAFC have.
I will check it and reimburse him in full.

, your a muppet, geez some times I reckon Freeze may be right that all you Swannies people are a tad precious, masters of making mountains out of mole hills. To put an end to this, all I am saying is that if Swans had payed their players they may have been in a tad more trouble. Im not saying more or less than WP, my mate didn't receive his match payments, full stop !!!

Leedy, you don't get out of it that easy.
I don't revert to name calling , I deal in substantiated truth.
What you are insinuating is that Swans didn't pay match payments based on your friends say so that he believes he is owed money.
So how much in $$ of match payments is there that you are saying that we missed . Put a figure on it and then ask how would that have placed us anywhere near the WP scenario. .
It is a matter of record that Swans lost over $900k in the 2011/12 period, they were cash strapped, didn't hold up the white flag and paid all their creditors.
It is not about being precious, it is about quashing some of the bull that surrounds Swans past and present situation.
I have documented proof, what you have is innuendo and rumor.
I reiterate, if your friend or any other person can come forward and substantiate that they were not paid, I will reimburse them and give you double.
So either put up or shut up.

You sound articulate in patches Swansmen. Once again, I clearly stated that I am not phased, sure on the actual number of players or even give a shit as to what position Swans would have been in. I am stating that I know for certain 1 x player didn't receive his payments and he said others didn't either (the latter I can agree is unsubstantiated). I don't and won't reveal my source, Swandog and BH know who Im talking about and if they want reveal it, go for gold, for mine, it is irrelevant now, I only mentioned it because it shits me to tears when the likes of yourself, BH and Co go WP bashing, it is what it is, let it go.

To finalise and reiterate, at the initial meeting last year us Members were told we had go down the path we did or fold, there was categorically no other option, Im not a man of numbers so I and all other Members had to back the people in charge and let it pan out.

if swans members had backed the people in charge we would have gone to the wall. Instead we threw out the ones that didn't have the decency to fall on their swords and started a fresh.
I don't recall ever bagging out West Perth. They knew what the position was, why do you think they asked Brett Raponi to step aside in favour of Swans former CEO.

therealswansman wrote: DW & BH , Harding cant coach anyone older than 18 as he had no man management skills at all. He was never denied the resources, that other clubs managed to recruit. What he and Smart were prevented from doing was to throw money away on Parasites, like Twomey, Robinson, Roach & Co.
{begs the question though how Robinson & Twomey our highest paid players left to play for Subaico on less money) They spent money on Hams, Slater, Wytick, Houghton, Clutterbuck, Rogers, and his little ginger haired mate (name escapes me) and bigger money on Newman, Garlett & Yarran,
Harding & Smart had no control over the big ego's and many often openly derided Harding.
There was no leadership, the drug takers were left alone without penalties.
The two Directors that got Swans back on their feet financially, Douglas & Dawson both left when it was evident that Hodyl and Holmes and other Board members whose roles could also not be identified had no idea how to set proper KPI's and then insisted on extending both Harding and Smarts contracts based on them having achieved KPI's that were never explained.
WE are in this hole because of of weak and ineffective leadership from the top down.
Check out our website and you will see that playing finals footy is not one of our goals.

Thanks for the reply...that last line of response pretty much sums up why I’m struggling to remain emotionally involved over the past 16months.

therealswansman wrote:

R U Serious wrote: Such as are we still paying off our debt to the ATO etc.

ATO debt now nil.
But what did happen is the loss wiped out all working capital which can only be replaced with making continuous profits year after year.
Swans current liabilities still exceed their current assets, the measure of solvency, but as long as they don't fall behind in paying current creditors there isn't a problem.
In fact Swans Present balance sheet liquidity wise, is worse than WP's when they held up the white flag.
The difference is that while Swans did deals with all their creditors on repayment terms that remain in place today for current debt, hence they can't be considered to be trading insolvently, WP Directors when learning the definition of insolvent trading and the consequences for Directors held up the white flag.

Don't get frustrated by the numpties and there are a few of them. Swans are one of the clubs that made business decisions and have worked to get themselves into a better position whilst other just throw in the towel. My club took a decision that we all hated and got pilloried for and rightly so but we at least saw the issues before they got to out of hand. You only have to question some of the numpties and they get antsy but is just a reflection of the person. Keep up the honesty

DW - I have no problem with the club trying to re-position itself as a community provider for different services as i think that is our best chance of survival as a football club. We will be able to get revenue into the club to support those programs and therefore be able to keep running as as the SDFC.
I would like to see the club provide members and supporters with more up-to-date news on football matters and look to provide their thoughts on how we are looking for this season and the years ahead.
the footy manager, coach and footy director need to step up and let supporters know what is happening.
no problem with stories on community activities but doesnt mean we cant also have football updates.

This is what you wanted Mark.

Coaches Pre-Season Update
Wednesday, March 27, 2019 - 1:06 PM

After a long pre-season we go into 2019 with a few knowns and a few unknowns. The squad looks considerably different from years past, and even looking at our team photo from last year, I think there was 30 faces in that picture no longer in our squad.

There are still our senior group Notte, Ellard, Riggio, Howard, Gault, Blakely, Noble, Payne, Turner and Clutterbuck, and the younger brigade that started to show some positive footy in 2018 in Hackett, Wilson, Ercreg, Raynor, Italiano, Cipro, O’Sullivan, Reidy, Fullgrabe, Dean and Maguire.

Throw in a reasonably successful reserves group and Colts squad that played off in a grand Final. We will have a young group, but a talented group.

All the hard work from Phil Smart and Mick Moylan has come to a bit of fruition with the more senior additions to our senior squad. We seem to have added some real quality top end talent with Jesse Glass McCasker coming back to the club after a stint at AFL, George Hampson from East Fremantle coming off a best and fairest and Josh Simpson coming back to Perth after playing up in Geraldton and working away for the past couple of years. Also coming BACK to our club are some senior guys in Leigh Kohlmann and Anthony Stephens, both more senior in age but still relatively young in playing experience at this level. These five guys have already had an impact over the summer with our group, and hopefully will in the season proper.

Two younger guys in Aiden Clarke and Dylan Smith are back in 2019, both are extremely talented young men who probably realised that WAFL footy needed another crack from them.

The pre season training program had a real focus on our standards. Lifting our standard of training and application to the program, instilling good behaviours to our younger squad that will stand them in good stead for future seasons as well as this one. I thought this was evident in our pre season hit out against Subiaco. Although going down by 6 goals, we actually won the second half on the scoreboard and looked to be running well at game end.

Looking at the proper season which is almost upon us, our overall mentality will be continual improvement. This looks like it is going to be a tight season in the WAFL, with every game a big one. Eighth is not where we want to finish again, and we have been working extremely hard to be better than that this year. There will be ups and downs with our young squad, but, there will be exciting times throughout 2019.

Our last pre season game is this week away against Claremont, and then Round 1 the following week at home against South Fremantle.

Hope to see you all throughout the year.

Adam