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I think our bowlers did bowl too short in this series AM. I think they were motivated to do this because of an impression that Indian batsmen had trouble with short stuff which may have been true in previous series but not this time.

Does it require special atmospheric conditions to swing and reverse swing the ball.
You can change your test ball at 80 overs.Does a ball between 50+60 reverse.Then stop reversing.
Swing bowling with overcast conditions. Or bowling into the SW breeze at the Waca.Up at the Gabba.
Wide open arm bowling action like J Thompson Shaun Graff,Garth Le Roux [WSC) Malinga from Sri Lanka.We don't have any of thoes sling shot bowlers in Au any more.Brett Lee arm delivered the ball fully stretched above his head.+ Glenn McGrath But Lee couldn't swing the ball in the Uk.
Sir Ian Bothom use to jump as he bowled from a short run up.He could do anything with the ball.
Not sure what our coaches are teaching our young players today.

anch, gtr, mikeh: great posts all

I also think it is a lttle bit to do with the pace you bowl, sending them down at a slower speed is simply uncouragged in Australian cricket; most of our swing bowllers, as we know, bowlled medium pace from Massie through to Adam Dale.

ArkRoyal wrote: anch, gtr, mikeh: great posts all

I also think it is a lttle bit to do with the pace you bowl, sending them down at a slower speed is simply uncouragged in Australian cricket; most of our swing bowllers, as we know, bowlled medium pace from Massie through to Adam Dale.

Pace Ark is one forsure.When Lillee slow down same as Hadley at the ends of there careers.They moved the ball everywhere.Coaches teach the young fast bowlers to keep a compact bowling action. Andy Roberts use to open his body sideways b4 bowling .He could swing at pace.

anchorman wrote: It seems that we are the only national side that can not get the red ball to swing or reverse swing.Even with the use of sand paper.
We are trying the Duke ball in the remainder of the shield games , after the BBL.Will this be of any assistance to our quicks.
The question I ask, is what are we doing wrong in trying to get the ball to swing reverse. Or maybe more to the point, what is every one else doing to make it happen!!!!
Is it that we bowl the wrong lengths.Do we bowl too short.

Question 1: It's physics knowledge as Professor Julius Sumner Miller pointed out fifty years ago. Simple FRICTION.. No such thing as reverse swing until invented by the Poms. If one side of the ball is rough & one side is smooth the rough side encounters more friction causing the ball to turn away (or in). Poms used MINTS to chew & rub on smooth side only & hence invented "REVERSE SWING". It is also called "BALL TAMPERING"
Only Warner would have been too dumb to work that out.
Question 2: We dont bowl two short as I think only ONE Short bowls in BBL.
Lets lighten up before its too late.

I thought the whole point of us bringing in former Pommy bowling coaches (and ex Australian First Class Cricketers) Troy Cooley and then David Saker was because of the success they had had with Anderson, Broad and co?
Are those English mints & English sunscreens not available in Australia?

nothing to do with mints or sand lads, rather it is the humid conditions in the UK and skill-- otherwise the MCC will try and take away Massie's 16 wickets at Lord's in 1972.

Massie and Alderman swung it a mile in England; Jimmy also gets more swing there.

gtr: Ian Chappell always goes on about the greatness of two bowllers; Roberts and Snow.

ArkRoyal wrote: nothing to do with mints or sand lads, rather it is the humid conditions in the UK and skill-- otherwise the MCC will try and take away Massie's 16 wickets at Lord's in 1972.

Massie and Alderman swung it a mile in England; Jimmy also gets more swing there.

gtr: Ian Chappell always goes on about the greatness of two bowllers; Roberts and Snow.

Wonder if Lillie & Thomson were sponsored by Perth MINT?

ArkRoyal wrote: nothing to do with mints or sand lads, rather it is the humid conditions in the UK and skill-- otherwise the MCC will try and take away Massie's 16 wickets at Lord's in 1972.

Massie and Alderman swung it a mile in England; Jimmy also gets more swing there.

gtr: Ian Chappell always goes on about the greatness of two bowllers; Roberts and Snow.

Ark Glenn McGrath speaking B4 the Big Bash game tonight on radio.Said Stark struggled v India.Because he couldn't swing or reverse swing the ball.Left hand bowlers seem to normally swing the ball a lot normally.

gtr: in general they bowlled too short. When was the last time one of our bowllers sent down a 'yorker'? I think this is the real test as to whether bowllers are bowlling full enough. One bowller whom delivers yorkers regularly is Rabada of South Africa, and , it is no coincedence that he is the best in the world.

Front foot play has developped a great deal in the time I have watched the game because of the introduction of helmets. In turn, bowllers have tended to pull their length back, which, has meant, that, even when they are trying to bowl a fuller length, it is actually a lot shorter than DK or Thommo would have bowlled.