TOPIC:

Ok So what do folks think of this shambles?

Last night Boris lost another vote, this time on calling a General election.

I can't see anyway of breaking this dead lock, and it's almost certain the 31 Oct deadline wont be meet.

There is a way Boris can get an election, that is to call on a vote of no confidence in himself, lose it and then call an election, if the opposition do a strange thing and reject the vote of no confidence, then he will command the authority of the house and members will have to back his legislation (in theory).

No body has yet solved the Irish border issue, Boris was in Ireland for meeting with the Irish PM, and ended up going home with is tails between his legs, they are not backing down on wanting a guarantee the border will remain open.

Its like solving rubrics cube this mess.

From what I have read, it is unlikely that the Speaker would allow such a motion from Johnson, as it is contrary to its intended purpose.

I reckon Cameron will go down in UK political history as one of the greatest villains of all time. By calling the referendum, he has allowed the country to shoot itself in the foot, particularly as at that time, there was never a mention of the possibility of a "no deal" Brexit.

the remainers are creating the problem/ crisis; remember the remainers have got themselves in the ridiculous position where they will not accept a referendum result or have an election. It is a completely irrational position which is unsustainable in the face of public opinion. Usually, you will see, if you peer hard enough, that the people whom scream'crisis' the loudest are almost always the ones' whom are making the most trouble. The idea is to cause all the trouble in parliament and society and then get elected to 'solve' all the problems which they started in the first place. The Nazis were very good at it.


how is a law a law without being supported by the cabinet? Read the Commonwealth of Australia parliamentary site on how you make a statute.

unless they have the courage to remove him, the country will be leaving on 31 October.
he is threatening to undermine the EU by using his veto -- this will encourage them to kick the UK out.

it will have its sovereignty back -- no Australian would agree to share sovereignty with China because we trade a lot
it will not have to pay into the silly common budget -- a second foreign aid budget

it will have money from the tariffs to subsidise exposed industries

ulster can have a hard border imposed by the Irish and Europeans -- the British have offerred them a free trade treaty which they will not accept.

It’s called a CLUSTERFUCK.

ArkRoyal wrote: the remainers are creating the problem/ crisis; remember the remainers have got themselves in the ridiculous position where they will not accept a referendum result or have an election. It is a completely irrational position which is unsustainable in the face of public opinion. Usually, you will see, if you peer hard enough, that the people whom scream'crisis' the loudest are almost always the ones' whom are making the most trouble. The idea is to cause all the trouble in parliament and society and then get elected to 'solve' all the problems which they started in the first place. The Nazis were very good at it.


how is a law a law without being supported by the cabinet? Read the Commonwealth of Australia parliamentary site on how you make a statute.

unless they have the courage to remove him, the country will be leaving on 31 October.
he is threatening to undermine the EU by using his veto -- this will encourage them to kick the UK out.

it will have its sovereignty back -- no Australian would agree to share sovereignty with China because we trade a lot
it will not have to pay into the silly common budget -- a second foreign aid budget

it will have money from the tariffs to subsidise exposed industries

ulster can have a hard border imposed by the Irish and Europeans -- the British have offerred them a free trade treaty which they will not accept.

Ark what do you mean by NI having a hard border?

The people of NI dont want a hardborder, Ireland are saying they want it open and its integral part of the GFA.

On top of that NI voted to remain.

Whats the point of UK leaving the EU to control its borders/immigration if you can fly from Warsaw to Dubin, jump in a bus to Belfast and then jump in a ferry to Liverpool and hey presto your in the UK without a single passport check?

I don't think your right on the offer of a trade deal with Ireland either, that would be impossible as Ireland is part of the EU any deal with Ireland would also be with the EU, Britain offered to leave NI as part of a special trade zone still under EU trade rules as part of one of Mays deals, but it was rejected by hardliners. seems fair enough to me as it was the only realistic solution, until the extreme unionists the DUP get involved.

Bazz: they have offered a free trade agreement with the EU, but the EU is not a free trade organisation. This means that the EU will set up a border in Ireland in contravention of the Good Friday Agreement. I am for a hard border.

I would give them a referendum down the track in line with GFA, but if the Irish lose they need to accept Brexit. In the referendum, some of the Unionists voted to remain, the old UUP, so it will be interesting to see how a border vote will go.

The DUP were the only political organisation in the UK to campaign for Brexit, even the conservative party was 'neutral'. given that they finished on the right side of the referendum result, they are actually representative of UK opinion on Brexit.

Scotland voted to remain in the UK, in the full knowledge that Cameron was going to hold a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU. The Scottish nationalists have little right to complain when you think about this little fact.

I was hoping people would leave this subject well alone. Had everyone have voted at the time, the referendum may have had a different outcome. I was surprised to learn voting not compulsory in the UK. Many did not initially bother to vote on the issue which is now a big part of the problem. Is now just one unhol;y mess now. Hopefully the 31st of October deadline will be met. This has dragged on for far too long.

The European Union are like Soviet Russia or Nazi Germany .They like to tell countries and people what they can do and not do.And who can live in there Continent.
The sooner the UK walks away the better they will be.Let the EU bankroll Scotland and there loopy PM.

Ark what drugs are you on?

Thats not how it happened, the EU said it was open to an agreement, but only when the Irish border situation was settled, which makes perfect sense given that the only land border the UK shares with the EU is in Ireland and of course the risk and history of conflict that no body in their right minds wants to return too, the EU most definitely does not want are hard border, they proposed the most sensible and workable solution that NI remain as a special EU trade zone alone alongside Ireland ( this would of been a democratic and consistent solution given NI voted overwhelmingly to remain). The deal would of been done and dusted had it not been for a loonies in the DUP holding the balance of power at Westminster insisting on them being treated the same as the rest of the UK, as a result May had to include the entire UK in the same zone which naturally was torpedoed.

And you still haven't addressed the farcical situation I outlined of a immigrant wandering around Britain with an open NI border as the DUP proposes.

The DUP were the only political party to campaign for leave??? really haven't you heard of UKIP??

As for Scotland and Brexit , mate your at least a year out, the Scottish Vote was in 2014 , Cameron never passed the Brexit Legislation until 2015.
And even if they did know about it which they didnt they didnt have glass balls and ability to predict the future, in any event Remain was always supposed to win.

Bazza: I did address all your points with respect. I simply do not agree with you hence your reaction to my post.
I support a full Brexit on WTO rules with a hard border in Ireland. What I also said was, if you read it properly, to shut the Irish up, I suggested a referendum on Ulster's future; but what I also said previously, if, once again, you had of read properly, was that if the Irish lost they would have to accept Brexit with a hard border.

Mrs May's so-called agreement would have kept the UK in the common market customs union via the so-called Irish backstop. In that sense, Bazza, her agreement represented a soft Brexit at best, one the the remainers in parliament should have supported. Keep in mind Bazza, that all the remainers -- some in the Tory party, the SNP, the Liberals, the Labour party all voted against Mrs, May's deal --Tell me why all the remainers did that Bazza? Was it because her agreement was bad? Or, was it because they want to reverse Brexit in full? -- never under estimate the psychotic nature of Brexit Bazza.

The DUP was the only establishment party to support Brexit --of course I have heard Farage's lot. On Scotland, Cameron first promised an EU referendum in 2013, look it up in the press, a full year before the Scottish referendum. I will repeat: this sequence meant that when the Scots voted on independence, they voted in the full knowledge that the UK may leave the EU pending the result of the future referendum. (the BBC reported the story 23 January 2013) The Scottish referendum was September 2014. In short, the Scots had the opportunity to vote for independence and negotiate their own treaty with the EU and avoid all prospect of being involved in the Brexit referendum; they chose not to do so -- maybe there are more Rangers fans in Scotland than the SNP realised?

Now if you want to continue with this debate, you need to be a bit more humble in your remarks towards other people, particularly when they may have different views to your own.